Incinerator latest - £4.4m consultancy costs

We also need to make this a priority very soon
The time has come and our space is running out
do we share one with jersey or do we go buy a biggun and import rubbish..making us money
We need to address this very soon
we have new members in our government who have the knowledge to find out what is best for us
I only hope it happens as soon as possible for us to have the best environment friendly crap eating machine we can afford

when the incinerator eats up all the rubbish you are left with contaminated waste that would need shipping off island thereby costing money.so yes we will need to look at an incinerator but we need to look closely at the mistakes made in other jurisdictions before a decision is made .

I agree we do need to sort something out but to import rubbish a definite no no imo , as i have said many times we need to recycle more as much as possible in fact then possibly build a cheaper smaller incinerator to deal with the rest .

When i say recycle i mean all things that people have no use for anymore ,like the one set up at Longue Houge but much bigger and including absolutely everything . Along with kerbside we could be n to a winner.

New guidelines released by the EU may mean the new waste plant proposed for Jersey could be obsolete before it is even built.
In order to meet the latest EU proposals, the efficiency rate of a plant must be higher than 65%.
However Deputy Rob du Hamel said: "The proposed plant at La Collette would only have an efficiency rating of around 24%".
The new information will be circulated to States members later.
It is proposed by States members that the ageing Bellozanne incinerator will eventually be replaced by a new plant at La Collette (from bbconline)

Why does this not surprise me....

TTS' position is plain stupid. They have stonewalled
alternatives for years which would be smaller, cheaper, more flexible and ultimately far more environmentally sustainable than a new incinerator. A new incinerator only makes the slightest sense whatsoever if one is only looking at the next five years or so. Any longer and TTS' reasoning is just idiotic - it takes no account at all of the necessity to develop sustainable ways of development and how that will impact on the generation and treatment of "waste" over the next thirty years (which is the planned lifespan of any replacement plant...). The independent Juniper report makes this very clear...

see my two articles on the Radio Jersey website
http://www.bbc.co.uk/jersey/content/articles/2008/05/28/sc_waste_nickpalmer_p1_feature.shtml

and
http://www.bbc.co.uk/jersey/content/articles/2008/05/28/sc_waste_nickpalmer_p2_feature.shtml

Nick Palmer wrote:TTS' position is plain stupid. They have stonewalled
alternatives for years which would be smaller, cheaper, more flexible and ultimately far more environmentally sustainable than a new incinerator. A new incinerator only makes the slightest sense whatsoever if one is only looking at the next five years or so. Any longer and TTS' reasoning is just idiotic - it takes no account at all of the necessity to develop sustainable ways of development and how that will impact on the generation and treatment of "waste" over the next thirty years (which is the planned lifespan of any replacement plant...). The independent Juniper report makes this very clear...

Hey come on since when has any states department saved money?

[/quote]Hey come on since when has any states department saved money?[/quote]

I was just dreaming! I sort of hoped they might want to save some money - I wasn't expecting all the environmental arguments to make much impression, even though they are blindingly obvious...

Have a look at the long version (4,500 words) of my argument which Isthisjersey have just published on their front page.
http://www.isthisjersey.com/news.php

It's long and wordy and somehat repetitious but it does cover a lot of territory, some of it virtually unknown outside of environmental circles. It sort of proves the environmental, sustainable argument mathematically and knocks a fatal hole in the indefinite, exponential growth apologists' position.

BTW, I am not a fan of "sound bite" spin... so, sometimes, my explanation of points can get rather lengthy and I try to write so that just about anyone can understand them, not just experts - "you don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows" - Bob Dylan

GD wrote:New guidelines released by the EU may mean the new waste plant proposed for Jersey could be obsolete before it is even built.
In order to meet the latest EU proposals, the efficiency rate of a plant must be higher than 65%.
However Deputy Rob du Hamel said: "The proposed plant at La Collette would only have an efficiency rating of around 24%".

This is because the EU say that incinerators should not be run unless the waste heat from the generators is used in district heating schemes to warm nearby buildings and provide hot water. The laws of thermodynamics say that an ordinary incinerator can only convert a maximum of around a third of the energy from burning waste into electricity - the rest is waste heat.

Having any new incinerator at La Collette probaby rules out a district heating scheme because it is too far away from large buildings and the town. As I have pointed out all over the place, with those other modular technologies that produce syngas (synthesis gas - largely hydrogen and carbon monoxide) it is possible to use the gas elsewhere from where it is generated - large buildngs, such as hotels, or the Waterfront finance district skyscrapers, could have their own CHP (combined heat and power) generators. Syngas can also be easily catalysed into synthetic diesel, displacing fossil fuel imports. Electricity from an incinerator, however, would only displace electricity from France, which is low carbon nuclear energy, so wouldn't impact on Jersey's first order carbon footprint much, or at all...

Nick

Yeah but the States will still buy it, they only think of today, never tommorow

Pegasus wrote:Yeah but the States will still buy it, they only think of today, never tommorow

Are you proud to have a cynical attitude like that? It's only people who seem to rejoice in their cynicism, while doing nothing, who allow a lot of things to carry on happening.

Nick Palmer wrote:

When this happens, fossil fuelled burners fire up to raise the temperature again - yes, that's right! - a new incinerator will actually INCREASE Jersey's carbon footprint (pyrolysis plants do not have this problem by design).

I should clarify this point. Pyrolysis plant can need auxiliary heating when the calorific value of the material falls below a certain point but they usually use the gas from the gasification phase both to dry the material and pyrolyse it. Where the pyrolysis system scores is in its modularity - low calorific value (wetter waste) can be treated in one module while the higher value waste continues being processed at high efficiency in other modules without being "dragged down". The fact that "wetter" waste is probably better treated by anaerobic digestion or composting in the first place really starts to show the reason why incineration of unsorted Municipal solid waste (MSW) is a thoroughly bad idea.

Government funds will be used to pay for Jersey's new incinerator at La Collette.

The Energy from Waste plant will cost a hundred and six million pounds.

The States voted to go-ahead with it yesterday. They had planned to borrow the money.

But the Treasury Minister Terry Le Sueur told members he'd found the funds to pay for it.

He said it would be cheaper than borrowing. (from Channel103)

Well it makes more sense...

more sense than what?

History would suggest a near miracle were it to do anything other than very significantly overrun the initial cost

I agree st-ouennais

I cannot see that ths cost's would be lower

St. Helier's Constable's trying again to force a public debate on plans to build a new incinerator at La Collette.

Simon Crowcroft's making another attempt at getting a public inquiry.

We're already on our way to getting a new incinerator to replace the one at Bellozanne.

Before the summer break states members agreed to a controversial 106 million pound waste to energy plant.

And it's already been giving in-princple planning permission.

But constable crowcroft's still determined there should be a public inquiry before full planning permission's granted.

The Planning Minister refused his last request. (from Channel 103)

An air pollution expert from the UK says Jersey's Government is putting islander's health at risk, by allowing a new incinerator to be built.

Dr Dick Van-Steenis says people here are already more likely to get certain types of cancer and suffer from depression.

He blames that on pollution from the existing site at Bellozanne. He also claims that the planned new incinerator will be no better and could even be worse than the current one.

Transport & Technical services dispute the view and say they that they are pressing ahead with the plans.
(from CIonline)

Although the Solicitor General has ruled there can't be a public inquiry into the new incinerator - the Planning minister says it's not too late for islanders to have their say.

Senator Freddie Cohen has agreed in principle that the new incinerator should go at La Collette.

But the final details - such as the design and size - have not been discussed yet. That will happen over the next few months (from channelonline)

Final plans for a new Energy from Waste (EfW) incinerator at La Collette in Jersey have been unveiled.

Outline planning permission was granted last May, but details about the building's appearance and landscaping around it have now been confirmed.

The plant, designed by Hopkins Architects Limited, will be enclosed in a box design with an exposed roof structure.

The proposals will now be considered by Planning Minister Freddie Cohen.

The States said two public meetings would be held in October to give islanders the opportunity to find out more and comment on the proposals.

Glass sides

These will be held in St Helier on Thursday 9 October at 1900 BST at St Paul's Centre and on Sunday 12 October at 1400 BST at the Ommaroo Hotel.

Will Gardiner, the States director of waste strategy, told BBC News glass would be used at either end of the plant.

"This will reduce the bulk to the viewer and also enables us to see inside the building to the way the process plant works," he said.

The proposed £75m plant is due to replace the Bellozanne incinerator.

It is expected to improve air quality, generate electricity for about 8,000 homes and have an active life of up to 30 years.

John Richardson from Transport and Technical Services said the new EfW plant would adhere to the very latest technical and environmental standards, providing Jersey with a reliable waste disposal solution.

"We have also paid great attention to the external aspect of the building and site and used building and landscape architects of the highest calibre to achieve the best possible quality facility with the minimum impact on the landscape," he said. (from BBC news)

Well maybe with "New" blood being elected the States might try to sort this out, but on reflection maybe not, the "New" boys will soon be brow-beaten under the regime

A new Energy from Waste incinerator in Jersey could cost more if plans are not given final approval by the end of October, a deputy has warned.

The French firm given the £106m building contract agreed to fix the price until the end of October.

But Deputy Guy De Faye has warned that any delay could force up the cost of the incinerator.

The plant at La Collette will replace the Bellozanne plant and will generate electricity for about 8,000 homes.

Health fears

Mr De Faye's warning came amid concerns about the affects on islanders' health, including breast cancer, from the incinerator's emissions.

But the island's medical officer of health has written to States members claiming the La Collette plant will have an overall positive effect on health in Jersey.

The note says the new plant will be more efficient, producing much lower emissions, than the current incinerator at Bellozanne (from BBC News)